Cardinal thinks Austria remains spiritual despite decline in Catholicism

Schönborn (78) - responsible for media issues in the Austrian Bishops' Conference - visited the Roman Curia on Monday and Tuesday with a group of journalists. The Archbishop of Vienna continues to be a member of the synodal council and is thus involved in the now broader process that is to culminate in a meeting of the episcopal advisory body in the Vatican in October. For the first time, 70 women and men who are not clergy or religious will also be allowed to participate in the deliberations and vote on an equal footing (and sitting at round tables).

Schönborn tried to dampen all too one-sided expectations of this process towards synodality - listening to each other. "If you only expect a result, then there can be disappointments," he said: "If we set out on this path from the outset with the certainty that what I have in mind must come out in the end, then it can be a disappointment, yes." Not everything is up for discussion, but the debates are not closed anyway, he pointed out, for example, to the document "Amoris Laetitia" after the Synod on the Family 2014/15: "That is certainly not the last word in the history of reflection on marriage, family, society."

Cathcon: The Dominican Cardinal thought that this document followed the teaching of Saint Thomas Aquinas.   It does not.

Above all, however, the "focus on the question of office" in Germany for women and non-ordained men, for example, "has not yet been received in this way in the universal Church", the Archbishop said. The voice of women is essential when it comes to social justice, family issues or the power imbalance: "But let's not block ourselves from the outset - the issue of office is on the table, but it is far from being the only issue." Moreover, he said, leadership positions for women are already allowed: "You just have to allow it and want it."

Another concern: "We here are already very much in danger of becoming too self-absorbed." For example, he said, the European Bishops' Conference has dealt with many issues in the 22 years he has been a member. "But it has never managed to bring about a common position of the European bishops on the migration issue. That is a grave disappointment for me." And further: "If the Synodality that Francis now wants to practise more strongly does not lead to clear words on the major social problems, then it has failed."

Cathcon: How about preaching the Cross and Him Crucified.

Schönborn gave a differentiated answer to whether there is still time for all this in view of church departures and the exodus of young people. "Yes and no. It is always too late," he said on the one hand, but on the other hand the church departures are part of a major social process and demography: "The number of Catholics will probably drop to 20 per cent in Vienna. Perhaps this will be partly offset by immigration. Austria-wide, we will certainly drop down to 40 per cent or less. That is the case. That doesn't primarily have to do with the fact that the Church has made many mistakes, but that is the social development."

In addition, he said, institutions no longer have the same significance as they used to. "We will not be able to stop the decline of Catholics by any measures - not even by any alleged, absolutely necessary reforms. It won't play." But, says the cardinal and Viennese archbishop: "Our country has become less confessional - but not less spiritual because of it."

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Cathcon:  Being spiritual does not save a soul, being Catholic does.