Head of Swiss Bishops on Conclave; speechless on homosexuality and celibacy as he does not want to offend

 "After Francis's death, many Catholics are offering me condolences, which surprises me somewhat."

Bishop Charles Morerod, president of the Swiss Bishops' Conference, explains the significance Catholicism still has in this country and why he suspects that the Muslim fasting month of Ramadan inspires young Christians to be confirmed.

In brief:

Swiss Catholics are reacting more cautiously to the Pope's death than those in Rome.

Bishop Morerod emphasizes dialogue as the most important tool for the Catholic Church.

The divide between conservative and progressive Catholics remains a major challenge.

Charles Morerod was on a train heading to Zurich when he learned of the death of Pope Francis. He learned from a journalist who wanted to ask him – the Bishop of Lausanne, Geneva, and Fribourg – a question about it. The fact that the Pope died just one day after his last Easter appearance surprised him and also made him somewhat sad, yet he says pragmatically: "It's normal for people to die, and Pope Francis was quite old and ill." The word "pragmatic" seems to fit the Catholic Church in Switzerland quite well. And Bishop Morerod himself.

In a conversation at the Ordinariate in Fribourg, the 63-year-old bishop speaks about the future of Catholicism in Switzerland and the divide between conservative and progressive views that also divides Catholics here.

Bishop Morerod, your boss has died – have you received much reaction from the faithful?

Yes, I have indeed received many letters, but I haven't been able to read them all yet. Many Catholics offer me condolences, which surprises me somewhat. I could also offer them condolences in return, since Francis was the Pope of all of us. In Switzerland, however, we deal with his death differently than, for example, Catholics in Rome. There, the Pope is like a member of the family. Here, he was more of a source of inspiration.

Who in Switzerland still listens to his impulses?

This question can be asked anywhere in the world. Those people who are satisfied with what the Pope says listen to him. He is a messenger of Jesus Christ and must preach the Gospel. In his last year, Pope Francis pleaded for hope and peace.

As for peace, unfortunately, he was not heard...

At the beginning of the war in Ukraine, Pope Francis walked to the Russian embassy in Rome to express his concern about the war. This had no political consequences, but it was still a powerful symbol. And who knows – perhaps his words and influence have prevented conflicts in the world that we know nothing about because they never happened.

The Pope is one of the most influential people in the world and is the religious leader of 1.4 billion Catholics, or one-sixth of the world's population. Should the next Pope be even more political?

Pope John Paul II was a very political Pope who contributed to the end of Communist rule in Poland. Francis also spoke to US Vice President J.D. Vance the day before his death. Hopefully, he was able to influence him a little.

Influence to what extent?

Vice President Vance recently expressed questionable theological considerations on the topic of charity to justify a certain disinterest and a tougher approach towards foreigners and immigration. He said that one should love one's family first, then one's neighbors, one's community, one's fellow citizens, and the rest of the world. But charity means that everyone is one's neighbor.

Bishop Charles Morerod, President of the Swiss Bishops' Conference, sits in a room in the Diocese of Fribourg and gestures during a conversation.

In the conversation, Bishop Charles Morerod explains the influence the Pope can exert on politics.

Speaking of the USA: Since Donald Trump took office, conservative values ​​and views have experienced a resurgence. Meanwhile, calls for more diversity and equality seem to be thwarted. Could a new pope counteract this?

Pope Francis, Raffaella Petrini, was the first pope to appoint a woman as head of government of the Vatican. That was truly something new in the history of the Vatican. I can't tell you what the new pope will do.

But do you think the new Pope should counteract Trump's fight against diversity?

The Catholic Church doesn't identify with any one country, as it is universal. The pope is the pope of the Catholic citizens of the United States, but also of many Latin American immigrants.

The Conclave will soon take place in the Vatican, shrouded in secrecy. The Cardinals meet there, shielded from the world, to elect the new pope. Thrillers often feature power games there. Can you tell us how it actually works?

No, unfortunately, I don't know any more about that than you do. And I don't watch such films. I can only tell you that a new pope will be elected there. I think they will be democratic elections; as Swiss people, we know well how that works.

Do the country of origin or political currents—conservatism versus progressiveness—play a major role in the papal election?

I don't know that either. But two-thirds of the Cardinals in the Conclave were appointed by Pope Francis, so their values ​​won't differ too much from his. And as for geography: Of course, some Cardinals certainly hope the next pope will come from their region. But it seems to me that the most important question is not where the pope comes from—but how good he is.

The future of the Catholic Church lies in Asia and Africa, not in Europe—the number of believers there is increasing, while in Europe it has been steadily declining for years. And there has never been an African or Asian pope...

It's not just in the future that these continents will gain in importance; it's already the case. Globally, the perception of European Catholics has indeed changed. Many Catholics on other continents already think that the Church no longer has much significance in Europe.

A little anecdote comes to mind here: I worked in the United States for a while. American Catholics thought all Europeans were socialists – because I told them that just because you're Catholic doesn't mean you have to vote for George W. Bush.

What are Swiss Catholics like in your opinion?

Expectations of the Church vary widely in Switzerland. There's a huge divide between traditionalists and progressives. Especially on emotional issues like homosexuality, opinions often diverge diametrically. For example, in Geneva we explicitly invited homosexual people to a Mass, which not all Catholics appreciated.

Is this divide geographical? Or is it perhaps generational?

No, neither. Young people have even approached me about the need for the Church to speak out against homosexuality. They said – I'll cite one example – that they fear their children will become homosexual later in life if the Church no longer takes on this role.

How do you respond to that?

Those are truly stupid statements. But it doesn't help to tell people they're stupid. Instead, I try to engage in constructive dialogue with them. Dialogue is always the right approach. Unfortunately, I also observe that more and more people don't want dialogue, but only look out for themselves.

Back to the original question: Wouldn't it now be time for a pope from Africa or Asia?

We'll see.

What are your personal thoughts on the topics of homosexuality and celibacy?

These are very different topics, and I don't express my personal opinion on them. Because I am a bishop for everyone in my diocese. Regarding celibacy: Pope Francis once said in a Synodal assembly that he could imagine abolishing celibacy. However, he didn't address this issue, leaving it to his successor. That's quite a gift. (laughs)

Cathcon:  He is a Dominican.  What would Aquinas have said?  

Should women also be allowed to be priests in the Catholic Church?

I recognize that the Catholic and Orthodox Churches are an exception in our society on this point. And I am, of course, glad that women have access to all professions. This theological question is quite complex: John Paul II's answer was that he had no right to change anything. Pope Francis has repeated this.

Does the Catholic Church in Switzerland need to adapt more to the realities of society and undertake a major reform if it doesn't want to continue losing members?

That's difficult because the Swiss Church cannot be viewed in isolation. The Catholic Church is larger than Switzerland. Moreover, many Catholics in Switzerland are foreigners. In Geneva, two-thirds of Catholics are foreigners. If the Swiss Church were to implement too major a reform, it would further divide its members and widen the aforementioned divide.

Nevertheless, we continue to make reforms in small steps. Here, too, a little story comes to mind. One cold and wet evening in Geneva, I once helped an old woman onto the tram because she had difficulty walking. She then said to me in a thick Genevan accent: "You save me, I am a Protestant, but I love you well when I am myself." (Editor's note: "You know, I'm a Protestant, but I like you anyway.") When this woman was young, Protestants weren't allowed to associate with Catholics. Today, a young person wouldn't even understand that statement.

Incidentally, I once told this story to Pope Francis when he was in Geneva, and he still remembered it more than two years later.

Young people go to church less often – and leave more often. Why do you think this is?

There are various reasons for this. In cantons that levy a church tax, it's often because people no longer want to pay it. Or they were baptized out of tradition because their parents and grandparents were Catholic, but later didn't come to terms with their religion. The abuse scandals of recent years have also prompted many to leave the church.

But I've also observed that in recent years, many people have rediscovered the church. Many priests in my diocese told me on Ash Wednesday how surprised they were that more young people were being confirmed. In the canton of Vaud, there were twice as many adult confirmations as three years ago.

You yourself received a reprimand from Rome for not initiating a canonical investigation into suspected abuse in your diocese.

Yes, I reported the cases I knew of directly to the police instead of reporting them to the Church. That's what I was accused of. The whole scandal has now sharpened our focus even more. For example, we require our employees to provide criminal records. But unfortunately, cases of abuse can be covered up in such a way that they never appear on a criminal record.

Back to the many confirmations in the canton of Vaud. How do you explain this?

This trend can also be observed in France. There, it is explained by the fact that many young people have been talking to Muslims about Ramadan and, as a result, have also been engaging with the Catholic Lenten season. That could also be the explanation here in French-speaking Switzerland. It would be nice if this explanation were correct and religions could inspire one another.

According to the 2024 Worry Barometer, fears of global threats have also increased. Do people turn to religion more often in times of crisis?

That is also a possible explanation. Many people seek hope in religion, especially in times of crisis.

Finally, I would like to ask you: What hopes do you have for the new Pope?

I was very pleased with Pope Francis and his work. I was particularly impressed by his ability to speak. He conveyed his messages with stories, not platitudes. And he always sought dialogue with everyone, no matter who he was facing. That is absolutely necessary. If we want more peace, we need dialogue. The new Pope should therefore follow Francis's example.

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